r/matrix • u/240p-480i-480p • 6h ago
Do you think Matrix was such a perfect film it was complete in itself, and there should never have been anything else to follow it ?
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u/cmaxim 5h ago
I enjoyed Reloaded and Revolutions had it's moments and faithfully expanded on some of the philosophical musings from the first movie while adding it's own unique elements. I'm not in the "sequels were awful" crowd. But yeah, the original definitely had it's own thing going and stands well on it's own. Nothing the sequels did ruins the original I think.
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u/RoadtoVR_Ben 5h ago
The battle for Zion alone is such an intensely emotion part of the series, and a very well directed battle sequence, that the trilogy would definitely be worse without it.
The sequels have grown on me over the years, and I’d say they’ve aged incredibly well. I think many people who disliked them would change their perspective after a serious rewatch if they never saw them again since the original release.
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u/GhostWatcher0889 14m ago
The battle for Zion is visually impressive but story wise having Zion basically destroyed and the humans almost completely wiped out sorta negates everything neo was really fighting for.
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u/DumbIgnorantGenius 5h ago
What about 'Resurrections'?
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u/Bobbybobinsonbob 5h ago
Only try to realize the truth. There is no Resurrections.
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u/_sLAUGHTER234 5h ago
Definitely unnecessary, but I'm always a sucker for hopecore, so I digged it
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u/DumbIgnorantGenius 5h ago
I just learned about it a couple weeks ago myself lol. Planning on watching all the films this weekend with my Dad who alao had no clue there was another Matrix movie 😅
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u/registoyyst 4h ago
It’s kind of terrible tbh. Feels like a bad fanfic that has too many “meta” narrative aspects but zero story. Dialogue feels like it was written by a 15 yr old
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u/Manticore1023 4h ago
it has that flavor of the other 'member-berries' sequels that have come out for other shows and movies. however, it was pretty fun. Neil Patrick Harris is great. and I liked the ending.
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u/Goketsues 6h ago
Yes, it was a perfect self contained film. That being said the sequels coming out didnt delete the first film, if you likem great you have them if you hate the sequels you can pretend they dont exist.
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u/conscientiousrevolt 6h ago
I never hater the sequels but they're obviously not half as good as the original.
So I usually don't watch them when I watch the original.
It's been so long since I've seen them that I recently watched just reloaded!
Don't want to watch the og too much, and since they're not nearly as good there's nothing wrong with never watching them or watching them without it if you do.
They're fine. But there's definitely no reason to watch them with the of every time like Lord of the Rings.
Every once in a while just to remember them. They've got some good action sequences and aura. And some real bad stuff *bowling pin sound effect!
I should watch Revolutions tonight 🤔
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u/TheTHS1984 4h ago
The first can be a standalone, but since i inhaled everything matrix back then, I'm really bad not looking through the glasses of nostalgia. I tried to hack the homepage, finished animatrix before and enter the matrix 2 days after reloaded was in the cinema. And even resurrections gave me that feeling back (a littlebit). Born in 84, this is my sort of star wars trench run moment. Sitting in the cinema like my father in 77 with an open mouth, not believing what I am seeing.
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u/datphunkymunky 4h ago
This is how I explain it. Born in 79. This is my star wars. Anytime anything Matrix drops I get that feeling again.
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u/phoneman87 5h ago
I don't see how another movie takes anything away from the first one. Reloaded was just as good to me with continuing the story. But yeah the first one is an absolute masterpiece.
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u/Helicopterop 5h ago
My biggest issue is how Neo is handled in 2 and 3.
According to Morpheus the one should be able to basically rewrite the Matrix as they see fit, which is exactly what the end of the first one was portraying imo, with him seeing the code and "destroying" Smith at the code level by jumping into it.
He then never does anything like that again.
In the next movies he just has a few super powers like flight and telekinesis, and he can fight better.
It felt like a retcon to me.
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u/_sLAUGHTER234 5h ago
Its because Morpheus was wrong about so much. The prophecy was a lie built by the Architect to keep the "anomalies" contained
Neo didnt have the power he thought he did. Like the Oracle said, he wasnt there to make a choice. He was there to understand why the choice was made
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u/Rock-LobstahhH 4h ago
The first Matrix stands on its own as a nearly flawless movie. Definitely in my top 10. I enjoyed Reloaded and Revolutions, but I dont think they came close to the first movie.
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u/GasPsychological5997 6h ago
I love the first one and it doesn’t necessarily need a sequel, but I think the sequels add so much to the story, philosophy and character development that it’s totally worth it.
I am one of the folks that saw all of them in the theater and loved them all. I watch them about once every year.
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u/Sam-Lowry27B-6 6h ago
I'm happy with the first film and leaving it at that. The other two and footage from the game could probably be cobbled together to make one decent film but the original does have that perfect movie / story quality that's hard to replicate
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u/AnAttackCorgi 4h ago
Should there be more Matrix? I’d say yes. There didn’t need to be more though, if that makes any sense.
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u/GhostWatcher0889 5h ago edited 5h ago
Yes, it was a prefect self contained story. Neo finds he is the one and will free humanity. I did not care for the sequels. They took what was a story about humanity, faith ect and expanded it in ways that felt like they were trying to be as clever as the first one but made it more complicated and convoluted.
The problem is they realized they couldn't just have Neo god in the matrix, like he was at the end of the first movie, so they have a stupid line about upgrades. Neo at the end of 1 could literally do whatever he wanted in the matrix and make the walls bend. But in 2 he can still fly but he can't stop bullets or do anything world breaking because they need action to exist still.
It ruins the perfect ending where Neo is actually the one and the matrix can be bent to his will.
It gets worse with the idea that there have been multiple zions and the idea of the cycle that repeats itself. Again, end of 1 Neo was chosen and was going to save humanity, but now theres a weird cycle.
Instead of freeing humanity, like in the first movie, he brokers a weak ass peace with the machines. I don't hate the idea that there would be peace on the face of it, but the way it's done is the humans are huddled in a cave in Zion basically almost dead anyway and then the machines agree not to kill them because of Neo. But, there is no guarantee that the machines can't just kill them. Its such a one sided peace that makes you think what was the point of it all. Neo saved a handful of people in Zion but there's little hope for humanity. The machines could wipe them out at any time. The architect at the end still sounds like he hates humans and will kill them if he wants to. There's no coming together moment that makes you feel like this peace might last.
It's such a weak ending from what we originally had in 1 which was uplifting and emotionally satisfying.
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u/stonecoldcoffee 5h ago
He stops bullets when fighting the the Merovingian's agents in the chateau, before they resort to physical weapons
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u/GhostWatcher0889 3h ago
Ok he stopped bullets a few times but he never exploded someone from the inside out. Which you would think he would do instead of fist fighting 100 smiths.
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u/Exalted-Stork-1308 5h ago
Agreed. The second and the third part look like a weak excuse for why we can't yet let go of Neo and his story. A generic blockbuster those with a lot of explanations, which don't really ever hit you the way the first part did.
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u/wishiwashappy69 5h ago
Watched it with my girl a few years ago. She's not a huge movie person but loved it. After she ask if there's a sequel and I'm like no lol.
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u/GhostWatcher0889 5h ago
The ending in 3 is like if in return of the king, frodo instead of destroying the ring or sauron he made a peace deal that if they killed an orc mutiny they would spare gondor.
Then the huge evil orc army just stops attacking minas tirith and gandulf says "look we have peace!"
I'm sorry but an invading army halting it's attack on a small amount of survivors from a battle is not what a lasting peace looks like.
The machines are never viewed in a positive light (except in the animatrix) and we have no characters on either side seeking peace and understanding, so when there is a sudden 'peace' it's completely unbelievable.
Watch a movie like Warcraft to see a good believable peace between two warring sides. The movie gives you characters on both sides to care about.
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u/Illustrious-Radio311 3h ago
Can't stop bullets? Like when The Merovingian's henchmen shoot at him in Reloaded?
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u/Rough_Locksmith_5033 5h ago
Even though Reloaded and Revolutions are flawed, the notion that the Oracle originally worked for the machines and that the One and Zion were all part of the Machine’s system for stabilising and resetting the Matrix are such good twists that they make the first film deeper in my opinion.
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u/The_Juzzo 5h ago
It could have been, sure.
I didnt like the trilogy until I played that tie-in game they made, when neo was magic outside the matrix it kinda ruined it all, maybe even outside the matrix, they are still in it, but it is never stated.
I pretend part 4 does not exist.
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u/tesseramous 5h ago
Matrix 1 uplifted me with hope and fantasy that I could have powers and break the system. Everything after that put me back down, showing the system is still in control. And the movies got progressively worse. But apparently the full trilogy plot was designed from the start so i can't complain.
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u/justmarty 5h ago
I liked the second and third ones better after re-watching recently. Resurrections was a fun film that I enjoyed more than 2 and 3. But if The Matrix was the only one, I would be perfectly happy with that. It is an amazing film that holds up incredibly well today. A classic.
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u/altimitt 6h ago
The Trilogy was perfect. It summed up everything with no loose ends (unless you count what really happened to Neo and Trinity). But everything was tied up perfectly. The 4th movie was horrendous. Every movie about the Matrix should have been a side-story or a prequel.
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u/No-Improvement-4962 6h ago
I like how aware the 4th movie was, it knew it didnt belong from the beginning.
With that being said, I had fun watching it. But how does movie 1 have better visuals than 2,3, and 4?
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u/thedon920 1h ago
Because they were so groundbreaking. And the set sequences were brilliant too. Originally + good old fashion entertaining scenes.
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u/United-Objective2149 5h ago
I loved the 4th movie but I seem to be in a minority
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u/RelativeCan5021 1h ago
4 was the Matrix becoming self aware. It was so hilariously and blatantly meta. I really enjoyed it for what it was.
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u/Flaky-Ad4695 9m ago
Am I the only one who watched 4 and thought half of the move was just cuts from the first 3? Why even make it if half of it is just a rerun. It’s horrible.
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u/GlobalCurry 6h ago
The first one feels like a good self contained film, I honestly don't remember much about the sequels other than the highway scene and when Neo fights a bunch of agent Smiths (only because of all the flash parodies in the 2000s).
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u/Dependent-Ad3484 6h ago
Yes. I ageee it was a good standalone and every sequel was at least slightly inferior
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u/Alternative_Device71 6h ago
No, cuz Reloaded and Revolutions expanded on the premise and made not only Neo more interesting, but the world building itself, not to mention Animatrix which is art itself.
I’ll never understand the argument of Matrix 1999 being completely sole form when there’s so much there to explore, it was begging for more.
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u/Fliptzer 5h ago
I thought it was a perfect film when I saw it on release. The other films were not necessary but I enjoyed them. Sorry, but I really loved 4.
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u/kylozen101020 5h ago
Yeah it was absolutely perfect by itself. I love 2 and 3 and the animatrix though. Such cool world building and character development. 4 was fun but I thought utterly unnecessary
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u/ProfCarmine 5h ago
The world building in 2 was amazing. Explained things that made sense within the world but didnt overexplain everything. You dive deeper and understand how all these systems interact with one another and the fight for power. Love the trope of explaining phenomenons that humans tell each other (ghosts, fairy tales). And still leaves it up to the viewer to draw conclusions of what it all means.
3 i still love but feels like it diminished a lot of that. Unfortunately with a big bad and trying to conclude a war it needs to happen, but the mystic of the world was the casualty. Because i grew up on the trilogy, i view that as the story for me, the one im most passionate about (similar to star wars). 4 i watched it once, i viewed it as an alternative branch or just dont care enough about the series anymore. I can see where it was ambitious, i can also see where it wasnt quite the vision they might have wanted. Either way if someone loves it, im happy for it (also like star wars!)
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u/Remote-Astronomer701 5h ago
It was amazing, revolutionary for how it looked and sounded. The directors had a clear vision and it showed. Everything came together the right way.
The sequels looked great but seemed to miss the mark for a lot of people. To me at least, I really liked the story in 2 and 3 and appreciate how the Wachowskis wove in different themes both religious and otherwise.
4 felt kind of like a story you would read as comic.
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u/sodsto 5h ago
The first movie works as a stand-alone.
In my eyes, the superman flight at the end of the first one hindered the sequels by making Neo too powerful. I enjoyed the sequels well enough when they came out, though.
On reflection, I wonder a little if the Matrix could have existed as a standalone for a couple of decades. It could've gone like Blade Runner, with a modern Denis Villeneuve interpretation.
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u/Disastrous_Potato160 5h ago
A fantastic movie that became an ok franchise that collapsed under in its own lore. The best stories leave plenty of room for the imagination and the first movie did a great job explaining things without explaining everything. The rest of the movies explained absolutely everything to the point that it wasn’t as interesting. But then they introduced even more on top of that which just made everything get super messy and bizarre. And if you acknowledge the fourth movie, it just falls apart completely by the end.
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u/_WillCAD_ 5h ago
The sequels were, IMHO, inferior to the original. I mean, watchable, but not nearly as good or as original.
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u/pmcizhere 5h ago
Sure, but exploring the universe they so masterfully built was too tempting. I'm glad we have five movies so far, even if one is a collection of shorts and the other a hilarious middle finger to the Hollywood beast.
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u/SaltyMeasurement4934 1h ago
But it was made as a Trilogy right from the jump. Therefore cannot compute
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u/SewerBushido 1h ago
The Matrix didn't feel like it needed a sequel, but I like the sequels, anyway.
I liked the comics from the OG website, too. They were sorta like the Animatrix.
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u/just_fucking_PEG_ME 6h ago
It was a self contained film on its own. I feel 2 and 3 would have worked better compressed into one 2.5 - 3 hour film.
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u/hummer4x4 5h ago
No!!! I loved all 3 what is wrong with you people and the 2 sequels? Don't mention 4....that was horrific
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u/Every1ThinksImBoring 6h ago
Yes. But also, I like the lore of the whole Matrix universe and I’m glad they were able to expand on it, even if the other movies weren’t as tight as M1
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u/Peregrine9000 6h ago
It's a perfect movie and the sequels didn't live up to how well this was executed. But the story was incomplete the sequels were lackluster but it didn't have a proper ending.
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u/TwoWrongsAreSoRight 5h ago
The Matrix makes me sad. Could the first one have stood as a standalone movie? a bit incomplete but sure. However the second and third added depth to that universe that could be a jumping off point for so many great stories. That's the part that makes me sad.
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u/ThaCapten 5h ago
The Matrix was superb. Mind bending. Made me personally free myself.
Reloaded was and still holds up as a really good movie. Action we had never seen on the big screen before and seldom since.
Revelations was also good.
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u/ProfessorOfLies 5h ago
Stand alone it absolutely would have worked. But I really appreciate how they resolved the trilogy. With the inevitable conflict between AI and their parents. The best way forward is peace. See also terminator 0. I am also fully aware the real world answers will be the ai just wins and humanity goes extinct
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u/Major-Proof7006 5h ago
I’ve only seen the first one properly and that I’ve seen loads of times including when I was 15 at the cinema release weekend. Mind blowing, just watched it again last week in 4k, brilliant update but I’ve tried to watch the second one a couple of times but found an immediate distaste for where the story was going straight away and turned it off. So I can whole heartedly say for me it’s a stand alone film. The dip in quality does the first film a disservice.
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u/Sayyestononsense 5h ago
movie-wise I agree. plot-wise, no. the Matrix as presented by the first film alone makes little sense, and the whole Neo thing makes more and more sense with the other 2, so in a sense they are necessary.
I never watched 4, and I'm not interested
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u/Desperate_Cherry2299 5h ago
Yeah probably. Everything afterwards except maybe the Animatrix was disappointing and reduced the effectiveness of the world building.
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u/SoBeDragon0 5h ago
I love the matrix and tend to be a sucker for matrix content. I am glad we got more of Neos story and we learned more about the systems of control, the machines and the universe in general.
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u/Mrmagoo1077 5h ago
"Don't try to enjoy the sequels. That's impossible. Instead... only try to realize the truth"
"There are no sequels".
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u/Bender3455 5h ago
The 1st one was great. The 2nd and 3rd fell a bit below it. The 4th was ridiculous.
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u/southass 5h ago
And you think people were going to stay quiet after being left with that last scene of neo flying? There is no way they were not doing a sequel.
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u/Responsible_Milk2911 5h ago
Its the best in the sense that did what it was made to do at the highest level. However the matrix universe isnt just the first film.
My metaphor would be that a top end ferrari or McLaren or whatever does what it does the best, but it opens the door to, and takes things from aeronautics or even space travel. There's so much more but when it comes to tires on the road, the first matrix movie is nearly perfect.
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u/Illmosity3 5h ago
I think the Matrix is perfect standalone movie. Idk if I can answer unbiased about sequels because I’m not a fan of the sequels story and writing choices minus Neo’s story coming full circle. I would’ve like to see more self contained stories and origins about the Matrix like the Animatrix presented. I always thought it would be cool to see previous iterations of the Matrix and what that version of the One went through.
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u/Ok-Grass-877 5h ago
Yes. The second one was good and the thirds one was also a good action flick.
But as a standalone movie, the matrix is absolute perfection.
Even if they ramped up the action, neither sequel came close to the awesome and ground breaking fight scenes in the first one.
I’m just glad there’s only three movies.
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u/ErrorPuzzleheaded866 2h ago
Everything I am about to write is strictly my own personal opinion and does not claim to be the absolute, definitive truth. The original The Matrix is a complete work of art, featuring a clear structure, well-developed plot and characters, a fully realized world, and a cohesive overall presentation. Combined with cutting-edge production technology, an incredible cast and stellar performances, masterful choreography, a blend of practical and computer-generated special effects, and a distinct style rooted in a core philosophical concept, the film was destined for success. Yet, as is often the case with such works, that very success becomes their Achilles' heel. Cinema—regardless of how we personally perceive it—ultimately belongs to the entertainment industry; it is, first and foremost, a product, and products are expected to generate profit. Consequently, the concept behind the original film was forcibly expanded through sequels. While The Matrix Reloaded and The Animatrix offered genuinely interesting ideas, striking sequences, and narratives that enriched the world’s lore, the third and fourth films devolved into mere assembly-line spectacles, driven by the "more is better" mentality. Below is a list of well-known films that, in my view, did not need any sequels: The Terminator (1984), Alien (1979), Predator (1987), RoboCop (1987), and, of course, The Matrix (1999).
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u/BaronSamedys 2h ago
Imagine how we'd all feel if the sequels were never made. We'd still be complaining about it now.
Looking at you District 9.
Whilst side-eyeing Rock'n'Rolla.
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u/SomePerformance2493 2h ago
I think the three were fantastic. I don’t understand the hate for the third.
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u/Illustrious_Cod_5843 1h ago
I would not call it perfect, but it was a solid film on its own. I thought third movie drowned in its own philosophical pretension.
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u/Aeronor 1h ago
Reloaded and Revolutions had some really cool parts, but they were somewhat unnecessary in my opinion because The Matrix was an excellent self-contained story.
I think the same could be said of the original Star Wars trilogy though. There was obviously more story to tell, and I’m glad it got told.
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u/centerwingpolitics 1h ago
I think, the movie fell into the trap that so many do. Where it’s fantastic as is, and it’s impossible to replicate its greatness because it broke so many barriers. It’s almost the problem with Marvel and other Superhero movies, you almost have to tell a different story great to have continuity and mastery but not extend the same story
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u/The_Evil_Chris 1h ago
The original film “The Matrix” was not only a cult classic but it was, as I like to call it, a complete film. Great story arc, the slap you in the face with a lot of literacy such as ‘Neo waking up’ every scene or so. The film has comedy, action, horror/thriller, romance, and drama, but mainly it has a definitive end and a well established beginning.
The base concept was something everyone could grasp; the existentialism of living in a world that is not real, being trapped in a reality that was artificially made for all of us. There is absolutely no major flaws or plot-holes in this movie that I can think of off the top of my head. It is a complete movie, front to back; so this film standalone would be a powerhouse, and it was at the Box Office at the time of its release to theaters. It is akin to cult classics like Pulp Fiction, or The Sixth Sense, or The Titanic; when you think of standalone top selling movies, this one has to be on the list.
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u/Ayn_Diarrhea_Rand 1h ago
The original is a near perfect film. It didn't need sequels and the sequels don't rise to the same level. Having said that, I appreciate the sequels for what they are. They're "good enough" that I appreciate getting to see more of the world and the characters from the first film. But the first is in a league of its own.
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u/thedon920 1h ago
The Matrix, like Terminator is an action franchise where its debuts were so perfect a film, that they could easily be iconic standalone films.
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u/LocusHammer 1h ago
It is a complete story. But I also love the 2nd and 3rd ones.
It's best of both worlds.
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u/Icy_Package4767 57m ago
The first was so well done - lean and stylish with sublime visuals. I knew next to nothing about it going in except that it was a sci-fi action flick with Keanu - sign me up. I remember being blown away by the first scene with Neo and Morpheus - I had seen many foreign films Woo-Ping’s choreography, but to the uninitiated, it was groundbreaking for a western film. Then the transition from the Matrix to the real and farms and the hovercraft and anime trappings… it was a dopamine overload - an instant classic. Yes, it could have held its own as a stand alone classic but geeks everywhere would still be crying out for more. I like the trilogy as a whole - certainly got more bloated, but philosophical overlay and realization of “what if AI won,” which is more relevant now than ever, is fascinating.
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u/kai_zen 4h ago
I love The Matrix. It has remained my favourite movie since I saw it in 1999. It’s the perfect interpretation of the Hero’s journey and an insanely cool universe.
While I enjoy the two sequels moderately I feel they were a letdown for someone who ultimately has the power over creation. IMO, it would have been far more interesting to keep the focus on the personal journey and less on the war with Zion.
Neo has the power of God. He can rewrite the Matrix as he sees fit. This is absolute power and we know what that does.
This is the dilemma of God in our lives. A being with absolute power who gives us free will to choose.
Wouldn’t it have been interesting if the Matrix was not designed maliciously from the machines pov. That humanity was sub consciously co-creating the experience through their greed/sin?
Perhaps a little too close to home?
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u/capspookyspork 4h ago
It reminds me of the newest star wars trilogy. The first matrix movie is very promising and a nice film. After that it just loses direction. Why couldn't the matrix do anything against agent Smith? Like it had zero plan for that?
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u/spicysandwich80 4h ago
Nope. I think the first movie was the best by far, but it was the sequels and the Animatrix that sent me down a million lovely rabbit holes that shaped my entire life in a positive way.
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u/Terrible_Bee_6876 4h ago
No the sequels were mostly pretty good, I thought we were done pretending otherwise tbh
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u/Ryguy9089 4h ago
Matrix is more than great by itself. Reloaded was very good. Revolutions was Meh.
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u/Bizneyland 4h ago
No, but the 2nd one was so awful and confusing that everyone left the theaters feeling very unresolved and duped. We all expected magnificence of storytelling and got none of that. for anyone around back then it completely took the wind out of our sails. We all waited years. 3rd brought it back a bit, but we were so assaulted by #2 that our expectations going into #3 were in the gutter and we just wanted it over with. most of us didn't see at theater we were so burned by #2 and we waited till it was on video or free TV
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u/TheBookofBobaFett3 4h ago
The sequels are what they are. High on their own supply? Possibly rightly for good or ill.
But I’m just annoyed they skipped the part where Neo was awesome and loving it and kicking ass.
End of 1 - Gets powers
Start of 2 - Bored as fuck of powers
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u/SeagullKebab 4h ago
No. It didn't have a narrative ending. It had a climax of character and story development, and then it ended. That isn't bad, nor does it demand further movies, but a perfect movie should have a narrative ending within its runtime.
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u/mrsunrider 4h ago
I think it could have stood alone and at the time when I didn't know how well it did, kind of expect that. But the ending was open enough that it was going to have a follow-up.
And I love the sequels so I was thriving.
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u/STLrobotech 4h ago
All these years later and one of my biggest fandoms I can see some arguments with the sequels but I personally love them. I think the series would've been better overall if there was a movie in between 1 and 2 that was more small scale freeing people, Neo finding more powers, and the machines reacting to him in new ways. I also think 2 and 3 are 1 movie so there could have been 1 more showing an end to the war for real, and the background build up of the faction we saw from 4. Just my opinions but I still love the trilogy the way it is.
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u/ElectricalEgg2711 4h ago
Being born in 97’ I grew up on sequels: Matrix 2 & 3, Spider-Man 2 & 3, X-Men 2 & 3, Terminator 2 & 3, Underworld 2, Dark Knight (Batman 2), Dragon Ball Z(instead of the original) and I’m biased to sequels cause I’ve watched them first and then watching the first movie is like a lore/canon event 😭 so I really don’t know how to feel in these particular discussions 🤣🤷♂️
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u/lessermeister 4h ago
No. I saw it in the theater and words can’t begin to express the post-credits feeling, but it needed the two sequels to put the story to bed.
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u/howmaster16 4h ago
No, although the other movies aren't nearly as well done, I still find the mythos, lore and characters of 2 and 3 quite fascinating. And It took me a while to fully understand them all.
Edit: I should probably clarify, the first film could have been fine on its own complete story, and it did not need nor require the sequels. I just meant that 2 and 3 fit fine with the overall story.
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u/lern2swim 4h ago
No. Movies are not diminished by sequels or remakes. And the sequels all add interesting things that make them worth existing, even with their faults.
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u/Icosotc 4h ago
I essentially view Reloaded and Revolutions as one long film, seeing as they were both written as one huge script that was split into two, and then filmed at the same time like LotR.
While not perfect, they are ambitious as fuck. I’ve still never seen anything that rivals the mech battle in Zion.
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u/TransparentMastering 4h ago
Yes.
I am resolved that my children will only see the first one until they move out of the house. But while I’m still the parent I’m preventing foolish decisions.
(Jk they weren’t that bad)
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u/ilikepentatonics 4h ago
First movie really stands by itself. It didn't need to be a trilogy, but I'm glad we got it. I love these films and the Animatrix.
I'm bummed that the fourth movie felt like it overstayed it's welcome. I loved the first 30 minutes and how meta it was but then it really didn't have much else to say. And even the action sequences were so lackluster, it felt like such a step down. There's only so many times you can see Neo do this and not get bored.
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u/robertoiglesias271 4h ago
No. Although I love the first movie, there are a few small plot holes on the agents’ part and Neo barely has a personality
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u/Upbeat_Suspect_6100 4h ago
There’s only 3 Indiana Jones movie’s, only 2 Terminators and 1 Matrix.
Also only 2 Alien films…
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u/Wolfmanreid 4h ago
I remember watching it when it came out and immediately saying “wow what a great movie. Not really set up for a sequel though”. Watching the sequels didn’t change my opinion of that.
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u/notadolphinn 3h ago
Over the years I've grown to find that, for me at least, I can't just watch one. It doesn't feel complete without burning an afternoon watching all three back to back.
The fourth one is ass though and I really could not enjoy it so I just omit it
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u/JusAxinQuestuns 3h ago
The Matrix universe is worthy of telling more stories in, and I think lots of little side-quests they did between the video games and the animatrix, and a lot of reloaded did that very well. They're going to have to take bigger risks or be willing to indulge more with prequels and fleshing out the universe if they want to do more with it.
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u/allofdarknessin1 3h ago
For me personally no. Depends on how powerful we accept Neo as. Some of it would be better yes but also it undermines just how much control and threat the machines are to Zion and mankind. It's just too big a picture to say he became the one and ended the machines. Showing people like he said on the phone at the end won't make them easily wake up although that would help a lot.
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u/Pau-Brasil 3h ago
I think the trilogy is needed, and i even like ressuctions.
To me, the first one is know thyself, you cannot save the world if you cannot save yourself.
The second is about love. You cannot save the world if you think of it in terms of numbers, cold logic, or blind faith will never get you in a position to actually change things, but love will. Thats why Neo is different from previous anomalies, love gets them the keymaker, gives them why, gives them purpose.
The third one is about sacrifice, you cannot save the world if you're not willing to put the work, change is scary as fuck, and does not look the way you imagine it to be. Every antagonist in this movie is unable to let go, to actually sacrifice and change.
Ressurections is about maitenance and vigilance, and connection. The war is never won, they will always try and come back. Isolation, brings nothing, it is only through connecting with others that we can keep what we've won through hard times and sacrifice. And its also hopecore, maybe after everything we might be happy after all (ive not seen the fourth one as much as the others though.)
Oh, and animatrix is how everything went to shit and how everything sucks but we gotta fight nonetheless, cause its the only way foward. Maybe not for us, but definitely for the world.
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u/Hobbsendkid 3h ago
I think if you like it as a standalone movie that's awesome, but IF you want there is more stuff :)
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u/ShaladeKandara 3h ago
Yes, open endings to good stories can make for great cinema. Making new installments after that point detracts from the whole.
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u/ArkuhTheNinth 3h ago
I love 2 and 3. 4 was disappointing but the one thing it got to do was set up for future installments where we move beyond Neo and Trinity which I'm kind of interested in. I'm in love with this universe and so long as they don't keep fucking it up, I can forgive 4.
However, if the first one had been standalone, it would have been perfectly fine. It's nearly flawless as-is.
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u/Ardenraym 3h ago
Relative to what the sequels did, sure - that first movie is in a class of itself, an entirely different world.
But the world that first movie created - the sequels could have been so much more.
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u/Kosstheboss 3h ago
I thought it was great as a triology. The first was an elevation of film making as a whole and certainly could have stood on it's own for all time. The animatrix was as brilliant as the first film in it's expansion of the lore and world building. There were problems with 2 and 3, but no more than any sequal of a great franchise and it brought solid closure. Four was completely unnecessary, but still entertaining, and not even in the top five offenders of beloved film bastardization.
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u/Beadyeyed12 3h ago
Perfect is subjective, but it definitely works as a standalone film. The sequels were unnecessary, but they told a good, even if imperfect, story. That said, I watch the freeway scene from Reloaded often because of how "perfect" it is.
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u/GentlemanJimmer 3h ago
Yes. Although The Animatrix was well done as a thoughtful set of collected side projects.
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u/Daddy_Benevolent 3h ago
It would have been interesting to see where they could have taken the story if they had made sequels.
The Matrix as a stand-alone film is brilliant, and suggests the possibility of really.intereetong world buiiding.
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u/EdgyPun34257 3h ago
No, i don't think there's any such thing as a story that should never be followed up.
And frankly nobody thinks that... What people mean is nothing should follow the story unless it's worthy of it.
Nobody hates a great sequel. People hate lazy cash grabs
For example, see The Matrix reloaded, revolutions, and Resurrections.
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u/NoWarning789 3h ago
Nope, I think artists, creators, directors, actors should do whatever they want, including making sequels, remakes, reimagined versions. I think it's petty that people think that because they didn't like a think, the creator shouldn't have created. Creating is always an experiment. If you don't want to be disappointed, don't watch any movies.
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u/NoStatistician1821 3h ago
Exactly. For me there are 2 first matrices: one which is standalone and one as trilogy part. Honestly, the standalone version of perception I like even more…
Whe he flies at the end and Rage playing is such a defining moment for all 90s generation… such an F U)
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u/Eccentric_Cardinal 3h ago
Could the original movie have existed on its own as a perfect masterpiece to stand the test of time? Yes, sure.
Would I have preferred that? Absolutely not. I love Reloaded just as much as the first movie and I really like Revolutions despite some flaws. The Matrix Path of Neo game is awesome and the Animatrix is one of my favorite animated movies ever!
The Matrix world and lore has so much potential that I'm glad it got more even if not everything is as perfect as the first movie.
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u/Reasonable_Buddy_746 3h ago
The three follow each other perfectly, and i consider them just one film cut into three. Yes they are perfect.
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u/FLcitizen 3h ago
Yes. I think if there was anything to make after should have been either a tv series like HBO level or some sort of animated show.
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u/clickmagnet 3h ago
I’d have been really disappointed to never get a sequel after Neo rage-against-the-machined into the air in the last shot. If you’re going to set up the sequel so perfectly, you are no longer perfect if there’s never a sequel.
What I remember of the sequels: first sequel fine, second just confusing, third one is just a rumour and I prefer not to think about it /s.
So they’re not great. But the first movie would be less perfect if there was nothing.
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u/Life_Category5 3h ago
The coolest part of the matrix to me happens in matrix 2 and I think leaving so many questions in answered in 1 and not exploring more would just overall hurt the franchise
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u/Reason-Abject 2h ago
Yes. Expanding the lore was great for those of us that wanted more but the movie could’ve just stayed as it was and it would’ve still be perfect.
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u/WildBigfoots 2h ago
Old 46 year old guy here. I saw the first film in the theater after watching the trailer once. I had absolutely no clue it was so crazy. Honestly when he went to the real world and he was on the ship and puked (he’s gonna pop!) I assumed he would wake back up in the fake world.
Loved that first movie. Second felt light on writing I didn’t like it. I don’t know if I would wish the second and third to not exist, but I am also not willing to make the effort that they should beyond employing a lot of talented people.
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u/ooqq 2h ago edited 2h ago
The first move it's too perfect. It takes it's ideas present you in such unbeliveable way that even to this day is a paramount archievment never seen again. You can't choose a scene over any other. The bullet time, the lobby, the helicopter, Smith interrogating Morpheus, the subway, the opening scene, the squids, the conversations with the oracle. It cannot be matched.
Said that, the two continuations have very good points and very good scenes also, but it was impossible to make it fit, since the first is so perfectly self-contained, you cannot add nothing to it, and you barely cannot touch it to explain something about it since it was already explained. So the sequels become somewhat a mess, throwing ideas that were very convoluted, and also presented in very convoluted ways: the Oracle becomes way too cryptic, Neo is able to fly but it looks like he forgot to do everything else, people at Zion feel really redundant since in the first movie the situation is dire and on Zion they have rave sex orgies at night, the defence of Zion with mechas felt disconnected, the skycraper thing is again extremely convoluted just for the spectator, as a reward, to be thrown at The Architect, you really cannot make it much sense out of everything until you watch them copious times and cherrypick what's important here and there, the plot is spread too thin over too many scenes, lots of them serve no purpose but to be cool, much like the twins at reloaded. Anyway it still have very high points, the relationship between neo and trinity feels incredible genuine, the entire highway scene is cinema history, the concept of choice or the lack of it as a foundation, smith becoming a virus... pick your poison
the only answer is that the entire trilogy depends on what you make out of it, either you love some movies, or you love some scenes, or you love some concepts, or you love some characters, or you love the kungfu, or you love everything.
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u/Think-Vegetable9781 2h ago
Just The Matrix is the blue pill. The rest is going down the rabbit whole, however uncomfortable it may be.
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u/Change_My_Mind- 2h ago
The, "this is the 6th time we've destroyed Zion and you are just part of that equation" kinda kills it for me. That said Reloaded has some amazinng action scenes.
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u/amysteriousmystery 2h ago
No. You can assume Neo defeats the Machines, sure. But it doesn't explain what would happen to the billions of humans connected to the Matrix.
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u/GreenQuisQuous 2h ago
Yes, the trilogy was bad and poorly written. It was ment to produce capital and not art
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u/Actual-Way-9570 2h ago
I appreciate them making a trilogy
I do not appreciate the other two being basically total crap
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u/JohnMcClane5 2h ago
I think the right answer to this is yes. But I remember asking myself this same question in 1999..would I want sequels even knowing they might not live up to the original....so even before reloaded and revolutions, I said yes.
I just wanted more, whatever shape or form it came in.
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u/literallymike 15m ago
The first was a perfect film. Not-overly reliant on CGI, but on ground-breaking, and innovative camerawork. The actors did their own stunts, and not a single ad-placement in the entire film. I knew the second two were money grabs when a) heard they were being filmed simultaneously and b) saw a FUCKING HEINEKEN POSTER in the second one.
Don't even get me started on the fourth "movie."
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u/Basilisk1667 6h ago
It could have easily been a standalone hit.
The sequels have some incredible scenes, but weren’t really “necessary”. That being said, I’m SO happy we got the Animatrix.