r/SipsTea • • 17d ago

SMH Thoughts on this?

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u/GarethBaus 17d ago

Yeah, there are still affordable vehicles outside of the US m, but they are usually subject to massive tariffs so they aren't generally an option in the US.

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u/PlasticStJesus 17d ago

If Toyota sold their Hilux work trucks they would absolutely own the market. But US manufacturers know that. So they have been tariffed to the point that Toyota doesn't even try.

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u/skbugco 17d ago

And that particular tariff goes all the way back to the early 1960’s, because we (the US) were selling chicken super cheap to Europe. So then mostly France and West Germany tariffed the imported chicken. To retaliate, POTUS LBJ put a 25% tariff on all imported light trucks (and brandy, and potato starch- which were dropped eventually). Most of the auto imports tariffs were also dropped, but not the HiLux, because none of it is produced in the US.

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u/Leonydas13 16d ago

Oh so that’s why it’s called the chicken tax! I just thought you guys were calling the Hilux chicken because it’s a smaller ute than your monster pickups.

Had a guy from Texas who found my Hilux funny. He called it a “baby truck” 😂

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u/skbugco 16d ago

There’s a great video on YT that covers the “Chicken Tax” on the channel “The Fat Electrician” (or maybe “The Fat Files” same guy). He’s hilarious and informative. 5/5 recommend.

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u/Leonydas13 16d ago

I’ll add it to the list of things to watch next time I go on YouTube. (I’ll let you in on a little secret: I never go on YouTube) 😂

It’ll stay in my brain but, and one day I’ll look into it fully.

The funniest thing was homies reaction when I told him it’s little 2.7L engine could tow 3 tons. He found it funny how we put towballs on sedans and even hatchbacks over here. Like yeah homie, slap a trailer on anything and you can tow shit 😂

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u/GarethBaus 11d ago

Yeah, the chicken tax is literally from a minor trade war that started with literal chickens. We live in a weird reality.

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u/Leonydas13 11d ago

Hey man, my country lost a war against emus. I feel ya 😂

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u/User69ab 16d ago

Yeah I tell North Americans that utes are “car-trucks”.

They are pretty tiny in comparison to be fair. The fact Aussie tire laws are so strict further adds to the miniature appearance.

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u/Leonydas13 15d ago

Yeah I always said my Hilux Workmate was basically a Corolla with a tray 😂

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u/kilertree 14d ago

They were still selling pickup trucks in America after the chicken tax. The Hilux was even sold in the US but got replaced by the Tacoma. 

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u/DanangBobby 14d ago

The form factor of a lot of vehicles also don't meet the regulatory requirements. I want a Jimny but will never get it.

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u/MNmostlynice 16d ago

Just spent a week in Ireland. The mid size trucks are awesome there, especially the Hilux.

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u/captainyorgan 16d ago

Shame since most Toyotas are made in America...

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u/PlasticStJesus 16d ago

It is a shame. HiLux trucks are intended as simple vehicles built for getting stuff done in places which might be inhospitable to normal vehicles. They're badass. But to remain cheap and easily repaired, they lack some of the expensive points of failure- including some safety features like airbags. In a country where people are used to paying premiums for things like power seats, keyless entry- so used to it in fact that things like power windows and locks aren't even considered a luxury anymore, Toyota correctly assumes they wouldn't sell well enough to justify building versions in the U.S. They are on a completely different platform than Tacomas, so it's not just a matter of designing in safety features and retooling a few spots on the assembly line. They would require a new facility altogether.

When the shit really hits the fan and we finally cross the event horizon from pre- to post-apocalyptic, we'll wish we had trucks like the HiLux. Until then we'll keep demanding longer wheelbases and leather interiors, panoramic moonroofs, LED-illuminated footwells and dual zone climate control.

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u/Devrol 11d ago

Why are people saying the Hilux doesn't have airbags? They've had them in every market for 20+ years 

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u/kilertree 14d ago

Toyota doesn't sell the Hilux in America because they have the Tacoma the Tacoma replace the Hilux in America in '96. 

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u/Wugtrio777 13d ago

toyota could build the hilux here but then it would cost them more than double to make it, thats why its tarriffs are still in effect, you dont get to take advantage of slave labor elsewhere they sel it here for cheap, thats what china does to other countries, put em out of business then take over then raise prices. toota has multiple factories inthe US, they could EASY build hilux trucks here but they dont because then they couldnt getthe same profit margin.

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u/PlasticStJesus 12d ago

They have opted for the Tacoma instead. It is designed with NHTSA safety compliance like airbags to make it compliant, as well as things like backup cameras, automatic transmissions standard, power windows and door locks, and other amenities Americans are used to paying extra for. I still think that if a bare bones, 100% manual (from transmission to roll down windows) truck was produced at a significantly lower price, people who need simple, reliable work trucks would line up to buy them. I know I would.

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u/Wugtrio777 12d ago

considerig so few peopl einthe us can s drive amnaual other than those who typiclaly drive trucks for a living, and have been trained in it, so it would make no sense to sell that, and then have to stock all the extra parts, clutches etc. right or wrong, manual trasnmissions have disappeared for a reason. But i did want to say the funny part os the person inthe topic above, says they just want barebones, AC, Bluetooth, a backup camera... lol as if THAT is bare bones, i bought my first new car in 1996, no ac, manual windows, am fm radio no cd player, hell no anti lock brakes, etc, id love to see these people truly get a barbones car and try to live with it. they dont weant barebones, they want mid level luxry at a stripped down price. they want a toyotas reliability, with a ferraris cache, a mercedes g wagon styling, all for the price of a Geo Metro.

I was in the toyota dealership when i was buying my crown signia, and there was amom in ther buying her soon to be in college daughter at the next cubicle, tryign to buy her daughter a car, they were looking at a used car i dont remember what it was, but i know it was an SUV, it was like 8 years old, and the mother was questioning how reliable it would be. and the salesman said " you know i can put you in abrand new Yaris for the same money, and that thing will never break down, " and the girl looks over at the yaris inthe showroom, and says " eww, why would iwant to drive that.". and i smiled to myself, because i had been dealing with cars breaking down for years and got sick ofit and now i only buy whats gonna be sure to never strand me on ahighway at 3am inthe dark with crs screaming by, trying to figure out how to get home. most people want style over substance or they want both. Thats why teh stripped down models no longer exist.

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u/HorsePersonal7073 16d ago

Not tariffs, the laws have been changed to require certain mpg/size ratios that trucks like the hilux can't reach. That's why 'small' trucks keep getting bigger, to avoid those rules.

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u/PlasticStJesus 16d ago

There has been a 25% tariff on all small trucks not made in the USA for decades. Google "Chicken Tax". It's been on the books since 1964.

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u/Available_Copy9433 16d ago

Even with tariffs it's only $15,500. It doesn't meet safety and emissions regulation standards for current US vehicles. Most of the "amazingly cheap" cars of foreign markets exist because of less regulation.

https://www.autonocion.com/us/toyota-truck-12500-us/

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u/blkhawk 16d ago

emission

I have a hankering that the emission thing might just be that the truck is too small. If I remember correctly then emission standards scale with size in such a way a small truck can not easily meet the standards even if it overall pollutes less than a larger truck.

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u/kfee12 15d ago

Lets be real the current US auto regs are fucking bullshit with how high they are. And the american ones are rarely enforced anyway. Unless you live in a DEEP blue state good luck getting someone ticketed for rolling coal etc. I fail to see how this car is somehow worse.

Yeah the hilux, a truck half the size or less of many fleet trucks it would replace, is problematic. It's the hilux.

Not private jets or cattle industries. Hilux.

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u/Available_Copy9433 14d ago

There's some standard that cars and auto manufacturers are held to for emissions standards, but the standards differ by the types of vehicle produced. I don't remember the specifics, but I'm pretty sure larger vehicles have lower requirements for emissions standards; this is a contributing factor to why so many manufacturers push SUV's and trucks on the consumers.

https://www.epa.gov/greenvehicles/smog-vehicle-emissions

I also think the safety standards for crash tests are higher in the US than in most other countries, but I don't remember that for sure.

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u/Devrol 11d ago

safety standards for crash tests are higher in the US than in most other countries

Aren't they self certified by the manufacturers?

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u/Available_Copy9433 10d ago

The manufactures run and demonstrate the safety of their vehicles themselves, but their tests have to meet the federal government's set standards.

So yeah, the companies run the tests, but the government sets the standard.

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u/FieldsToTheMoon 16d ago

Some of those cars are technically illegal in the US bc they don’t fit the right dimensions (basically auto manufacturers using their lobbyists to make sure their cars are the only viable ones) then the ones that are legal are not easy to get insured.

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u/okayipullup_ordoi1 16d ago

I was about to say, as someone from Italy there are cheap options aplenty here and in the rest of Europe as far as I know, and you regularly see cheap cars in Asia too, especially coming out of China, Japan and India. I don't know how much exactly lobbying by US manufacturer is to blame for the lack of a cheap market there, but I guess there's a LOT of that going on. And AI compaines are trying the same move with Chinese models, so it's almost like a tradition at this point.

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u/LearningT0Fly 16d ago

Also, we (USA) require all cars to have crumple zones/airbags, robust safety and electronics like backup cameras standard.

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u/Temporary_Bad_1438 16d ago

I live here and I hear this, but why then can/do we sell those stupid 3-wheel go-kart motor cycle things? Or when we sold SMART Brand cars? Just make a different class that puts the non-crumpleZone stuff in the same class as motorcycles and be done with it?

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u/Devrol 11d ago

That's not exactly unique

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u/LakEth2n 16d ago

Toyota can not sell a cheap car at high price in China. Because chinese car manufacturer add fridge, TV and big sofas(Li, Neo and others) in vehicle. Even a roof-mounted lifting tent(Xiaomi and Huawei) or a drone(BYD).

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u/123_alex 14d ago

subject to massive tariffs

Isn't China paying the tariffs?

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u/TheDarkness33 17d ago

Trump wins again!

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u/GarethBaus 17d ago

The excessive tariffs on light trucks predate trump by quite a bit although they are a great example of why we already knew that poorly implemented tariffs do not benefit the country before he made it worse.

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u/TheDarkness33 17d ago

not wanting to be that guy but honestly speaking, is there ANYTHING he made better? lmfao

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u/CalmTheAngryVoice 17d ago

Depends on one's definition of "better"...

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u/GarethBaus 17d ago

There are a decent handful of good things he has done but they are mostly overwhelmed by the harm of his other actions since he has done a lot of things that damage the US significantly with no obvious benefit.

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u/TheDarkness33 17d ago

Im european, thats why i am asking. The bad shit news arrives way faster that any good doing, if he even has any.

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u/GarethBaus 16d ago edited 16d ago

Most of the good things are more of a broken clock being right twice a day situation like signing a bill that happens to have a section that reduced the mandatory minimum sentences on certain non violent crimes(the US has one of the highest per capita prison populations in the world in part because it has really high mandatory minimum prison sentences for relatively minor crimes). As far as I can tell reducing the number of non violent people who end up stuck in prison for long periods regardless of whether or not the people sentencing them actually deserve it probably wasn't actually Trump's priority but he did sign that particular bill.